HomeMy WebLinkAbout1967-10-16 Town Council MinutesE
7
MINUTES OF PUBLIC HEARING ON MASTER PLAN
THE TOWN OF VAIL
October 16, 1967
The Meeting was called to order by Mayor C. E. Kindel at 8:00 p.m.
ROLL CALL Roll Call found the following Members present:
Mayor C. E. Kindel
Trustee Joe Langmaid
Trustee John Donovan
Trustee Peter Seibert
Trustee John Dobson
Members Absent - Trustee Burdick and Trustee Willett.
I/1INUTES OF THE MEETING
Mayor Kindel gave a brief introduction of the Master Plan
which was being submitted to the Board of Trustees. Those Members of
the Planning Commission which were present were: Mayor C. E. Kindel,
Trustee John Dobson, Chairman Fred Froehlich, David Gorsuch and the
Planning Consultant from Harmon, O'Donnell and Henninger Associates,
George Beardsley. Mayor Kindel then turned the Meeting over to Chairman
Fred Froehlich.
Mr. Froehlich stated that the Planning Commission was a
legally constituted body appointed by the Trustees, and their prime concern
is ,.nticipating the future needs of Vail as a developing community. Mr.
Froehlich introduced Blake Lynch, the Planning Director.
Mr. Lynch noted that comprehensive planning is needed to
guide and regulate the future physical development of the community, and
although it is primarily concerned with the physical development, it is obvious
there are certain social and economic considerations that go into it. The
Planning Board acts in an advisory capacity. The Master Plan is a conceptual
plan and through the years there will be changes made; because there is a
Master Plan in existence does not mean that it must be blindly adhered to for
years to come. Zoning is a tool to implement the Master Plan. Capitol
budgeting might be a phase that would involve the Planning Commission. It
would be allocating funds for public facilities.
Chairman Froehlich then introduced Mr. Peter Seibert, Gen-
eral Manager of Vail Associates, Incorporated, who complimented the large
at.'endance which showed an interest in the developments of their Town, and
indicated that all were welcome to contribute suggestions. Mr. Seibert
noted that Vail Associates, Incorporated, were not ignoring summer facilities,
but basically the thing that makes us grow now is the development on the
mountain. At this time the development on the mountain is approximately
257o complete. Some of the future plans are, (1) another lift into the North-
east Bowl, (2) another to the top of the Golden Peak, (3) Lions Head area
lifts, and (4) lifts to bring people in from Vail Pass or Black Gore Creek.
This would be at least 5 to 15 years away, and involve a 15, 000 skier day.
We have to stay in there in this recreational business and grow.
Chairman Fred Froehlich introduced Mr. George Beardsley
and Mr. Don Payne from Harmon, O'Donnell and Henninger Associates, who
presented explanatory material for the projections resulting in the proposed
Master Plan.
0 Page 2 - Master Plan Hearing - October 16, 1967
1. Lift Capacity
Mill Creek 5,000
Lions' Head 5,000
Vail Pass Access 3 - 5,000
2. Customer Break Down
Mill Creek and Lions Head (Spend the night)
Resident 7,500
Non -Resident 2,500
10,000
Vail Pass Access
Non -Resident 3 - 5,000
3. Residlent Guest Requirements
Skier Guests
7,500
Non -skier Guests
1,300
8,800
4. Development Requirements
Future
Existing
Lodge Beds
6,160
980
Apartment Beds
2, 200
1,000
House Beds
880
500
Permanent Beds
3,120
Restaurant Seats
4, 200
1,120
Bar Seats
1,400
560
Village Shops & Service
$160, 000
$50, 000
ShoFping Center
40,000
Highway & Heavy Service
5 Acres
Parking
16 Acres
5. Community Facilities
Conference Center
Performing Art Center
Clinic, Health Center
Churches
Elementary Schools & Athletic Fields
Visitor Information & Transportation Center
18 holes of golf and additional tennis
Swimming pools - one covered
Ice Rinks
Movie, Bowling, Racquets
With the use of slides of the Master Plan, Mr. Beardsley
• presented the proposed land use Master Plan.
Questions:
1. Fred Froehlich - Question of the Planning Commission -
What is going to happen to the core area here when we start developing the
second core, perhaps in 10 or 15 years.
Answor - The first core will be saturated before the
second core will be developed and it will be a natural growth.
0 Page 3 - Master Plan Hearing - October 16, 1967
2. Fred Froehlich - Question of the Planning Commission -
If the land now used for parking lots will be developed, what will be the
answer to the parking problem that we are now faced with.
Answer - Parking will then be supplied through structural
parking facilities.
3. George Knox - With the projection of two core areas, it
looks to me like it would be more logical to, in the beginning, establish
your shopping center half -way between the two cores.
Answer - The normal shopping center should be an extension
of Bridge Street.
4. George Knox - When you do that you are creating a bigger
parking problem. In effect, you will have two sets of parking.
Answer - It is planned to have at least two levels of
structured parking - short term - for the shoppers or visitors to the core
and at night that parking is free for those visitors wishing to visit restaurants
and bars in the area.
5. Unknown - The end product you will have no surface park-
ing existing on site?
Answer - There will be no surface parking in a few instances
however, some will be maintained at all times.
6. Bunny Kopff - What about Employee Housing?
Answer - 8% of the housing will be residential; 38% will
always drive from outside of the valley; the balance, which is about 60%, will
be people who need close -in housing, i. e. , split shift, etc.. There will be
an area that will be developed for them. There will possibly be some long
term residential above the shopping center with the structural parking below
the surface.
7. Unknown - To what extent is the Master Plan and recom-
mendations of the Planning Commission the thinking of the Board of Trustees?
Answer - There has been a considerable exchange of corres-
pondence, numerous meetings of the Commission and the inclusion of their
suggestions that have been incorporated.
8. Unknown - How close is it to being zoned?
Answer - The master Plan is implemented by a zoning
ordinance and it will be three or five more months before it can be drafted
and will be the actual enforcement tool to put the Plan into operation.
9. Warren Pulis - On your original plan the ratio of lodge
beds in comparison to Apartment beds is three to one in the future; right now
it is one to one - with the increased interest in condominiums, is there a
possibility that the trend would be more toward managed condominiums? Is
it conceivable that this might change in the future?
Answer - Large fully managed condominiums might sub-
stitute for a lodge function in some areas.
• Page 4 - Master Plan Hearing - October 16, 1967
10. Is Manor Vail an example of this concept.
Answer - Yes, the size that it takes to financially support
a management type condominium would be somewhere around 100 units. It
would have to have a food area and most of the condominiums tend to be too
small. It is very difficult to maintain a pedestrian village and Planning does
not warrant too many condominiums.
Peter Seibert said that during the slower periods of the
year lodges have a higher occupancy rate than the condominiums.
11. Have height factors been talked about?
Answer - We will get into that with the implementation
of the Zoning Ordinance.
do12. Bunny Kopff - Is there any way that we can make this
more than a two or three story town so that the village could have a sky line?
Answer - What we are talking about here is controlled
limits on the heights to limit any blockages of the facilities that we already
have here. We surely don't want a 10 or 12 story sky line. We are attempting
to maintain an alpine village here.
13. Ginnie Crowley - Is the village at the bottom of the Bowls
a myth?
Answer - This Plan does not encompass that particular
area. Our long range plan does call for facilities coming off of Vail Pass
at the bottom of the Bowls. It will be a very small fraction of what you see
out front.
14. Bob Manthorne - What consideration has been given beyond
the present Town limits by the Texaco Station and the Vail Village West.
Answer - Essentially we have been dealing with Vail lands
only. It doesn't mean that we are ignoring the rest of the valley. The rest
of the valley will be most important. The next step for the Planning Commis-
sion is to take a longer look at the whole valley, open space and land use
control. The statutes give the Planning Commission limited powers to plan
for areas three miles beyond the corporate limits of the Town. The Commis-
sion will be taking a longer look at a larger regional plan for the valley.
15. George Knox - Can we request the County to zone this
whole valley?
Answer - The County has the power to zone the valley. It
would not have any strength unless there were a County Master Plan. An un-
incorporated area can be zoned.
16. Will we contribute to landscaping on Highway Interstate 70?
Answer - No, it will be up to the federal and state Govern-
ment.
17. Wouldn't it be to our advantage to supervise this? This
would add to our growth potential.
Answer - The Planning Commission has approached the
State Authorities on a scenic overlook.
0 Page 5 - Master Plan Hearing October 16, 1967
18, In the studies that you have made, has there been any
comparison made between the week long guest as opposed to the one day
guest?
Answer - We have looked at the two spending patterns in
lodging and the propensity to some commercial shopping. We hope to do
more this winter.
19, It would seem to me that in the long range plan it would
be determined that it is not a real economic advantage to have the one day
skier in the core.
Answer - It is important to have them as an advantage
of growth and for midweek business.
20. Does the Master Plan essentially change the zoning in
16 this Village as we know it.
Answer - The Zoning Ordinance is the implementation
of existing use and for future use.
21. Would there be any interest incmdominimizing Lodges
on a very large scale?
Answer - It is a financial tool to finance some big devel-
opments, but it is unlikely to completely condominimize the village.
22. Do you ever feel that there will be a need for a high
school? Is this beyond our growth?
Answer - The plans here do not call for a long range
plan for a high school. It calls for a large elementary school. There is an
area being reserved at the western end of Vail which would be opposite the
lumber yard. Mayor Kindel indicated that the County was planning a High
School down near Avon, Colorado. The County would have a consolidated
school and the possibility of a High School here is very slim.
23. Concerning the possibility of the installation of a cable
or monorail, what space has been left or would it mean condemning certain
areas?
Answer - Space has been left in the event there is such
an installation as far as rights -of way. It is a flexible plan. Probably the
use of a bus system would be most feasible.
24. How can the parking in the Shopping Center be reserved?
Answer - A ticket validation system would be the most
workable and the ticket could be validated by the merchant. If the car is
parked for a longer period a ticket would be issued.
25. George Knox - Why does the Shopping Center need to be
in the middle of the parking area? It would seem that you have two parking
problems, particularly, if merchants limit this space.
Answer - Actually there will be more parking and none
will be eliminated until there is a replacement. There will be a limit of two
(2) hours.
b#*
Page 6 - Master Plan Hearing - October 16, 1967
26. Byron Brown - The Parking Areas are so much less than
the beds, it would seem that we don't have enough parking.
storied.
Answer - Structural parking does not show and would be multi-
27. Who is going to come up with the money for the structure?
Answer - This could possibly be a requirement of the sale
of the site. The Developer could consider it as expense, and expect a limited
profit. The space could be rented commercially or the Town could build
this with a Revenue Bond issue; could be repaid through a higher tax rate or
metered parking meters.
28. Charles Gersbach - Has there been any thought given to
keeping the traffic north of Gore Creek and transporting the guests from the
parking areas to the various lodges? It would eliminate the traffic that you
have now.
Answer - There are too many things that have to be served.
The Chairman of the Planning Commission mentioned that traffic control will
probably be discussed at a Meeting of the Board of Trustees. The Chief of
Police, Ted Holmes, would give the presentation.
29. Charles Gersbach - What is the present situation on the
Annholz Property.
Answer - There are a number of areas belonging to
private interests that have been indicated in white on the Master Plan, since
we have not contacted the owners to know their plans for development. This
will be the next step to consider all of the surrounding areas.
Chairman Froehlich closed the Meeting with the comment that the Planning
Commission and the Board of Trustees appreciated the excellent attendance
and interest that was shown. If anyone has any questions, maps are avail-
able in the Town Office and any one of the members of the Board of Trustees
or the Planning Commission would be happy to answer any questions that
anyone might have. The Meeting adjourned at 10:30 p.m.
•
V